The Rabbit Room

Thanks be to God!

Thank you for the reminder. That centurion’s words keep popping up over the place — and what an amazing comfort they are to those of us who too-often don’t admit the obvious.

One little niggle (because I really want to know): how would the writer(s) of that Anglican prayer address the passage where God says “Esau have I hated”?

Good words, JR. I’m not familiar with that poem, but it also reminds me of Jill’s song “Only Say the Word.” Thanks for the much-needed reminders today!

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“And you are dear to God nevertheless”

Thank you for these words. It is a good reminder.

Peter B, you ask a good question, and a fair one. I wonder if we could get Fr. Thomas to weigh in.

Eliot himself is of course quoting from the Liturgy. We say it every week in my church before Communion:

Lord I am not worthy that thou should’st come under my roof. But speak the word only and my soul shall be healed. (Repeated 3x)

“Ash Wednesday says, ‘No, no, no, dear sinner. You’re just dust, living in a world that’s just dust, and you and the world both are returning to dust. And you are dear to God nevertheless.’”
I love this. It speaks to me the same way as “Martha, Martha, you are worried and upset about many things, but only One Thing is needed.”

Jonathan, great post. I’m honored by the shout-out.

Since you invoked me, I will step away from my duties to answer on behalf of my little tribe.

In order to argue against the phrase “you hate nothing you have made” I think you would have to argue against John 3:16. God appears to love the kosmos (the world, the entire created order) so much that he gives his only Son for it. I can’t think of anything that looks less like hatred.

I think you’d also have to ask what you think the essential character of God is. Is he love (as he claims in 1 John 4:8), or is he loving to some and hateful to others? If love is essential to his being, then saying that he hates, in the way we normally use that word in the English language, is quite a stretch.

Of course, we aren’t dealing with the English language or Western culture. I think the use of “hate” in the Bible verse mentioned, when seen in context, leads one to see love/hate as a way of saying chosen/not-chosen. There is an accurate and short little article about that distinction here: http://www.gotquestions.org/Jacob-Esau-love-hate.html

Ultimately, the Church (at best) views all of scripture through the interpretive lens of Christ. If we can say anything of Jesus, we can certainly say that his entire being points to a God who hates nothing he has made. If we find a Bible verse that we think indicates God hates someone (in the way we commonly use the word “hate”), then I would suggest we are interpreting that verse incorrectly.

I have to run. Time to tell people that God loves them so much he came to suffer and die for them. Enough arguing over words (2 Timothy 2:14)

Thomas+

Jonathan! Was talking with my students about Ash Wednesday today. Should have just read them this post. Loved it!

In a hermeneutics class last year, my teacher addressed that “Esau I have hated” thing and said it was a literary device to emphasize the contrast of God’s great affection for Jacob. Like, “I love Jacob so much, it’s as if I hated Esau.” Not a literal hating, just an emphasis on his overwhelming love for Jacob.

At least, that’s what my professor said.

And Jonathan, as to your writing about Lent: love it. Sweet words.

Now probably wouldn’t be a good time to quote Mark Driscoll.

Jonathan,

You really are the smartest guy in the room.

Excellent. A very Jonathan Rogers kind of post! Even death can bring a smile and give us hope.

I love to see the good in religious ceremonies. Thank you for pointing it out in this. I was raised Roman Catholic and did not understand much of what it was all about. But now as a devoted follower of Christ, I am grateful to have been exposed to it. It is a wealth of spiritual nourishment for me.

Thanks, Thomas. I wouldn’t classify this as the futile “arguing over words”; what we say about God matters a great deal, and I appreciate the time and effort you spent responding to my question.